real estate prices in

MemeFirst: New York real-estate prices explained -- MemeFirst December 01, 2005 New York real-estate prices explained The 2.2 million jobs in Manhattan pay, on average, $2,025 per week . (You know that feeling you get when you find out you're below average? I've been having that for years.) Manhattan is 22 square miles, which means that the island of Manhattan pays, on average, $378 per square foot per year . And that includes Washington Heights. Posted by Felix at 02:54 PM GMT All proceeds go to MSF -- Comments #1 Pity we can't all work for Goldman Sachs. Posted by: Gherimiah on December 1, 2005 03:28 PM #2 I'll happily defer to someone with a firmer grasp of stats on this, but in the meantime, I wonder, does that average income number tell you very much? Given the massive disparity in Manhattan incomes, between, say, the dishwasher and the hedge-fund owner, which surely are among the widest in the country, wouldn't you also need to know the distribution of the data points? At a minium, wouldn't you want also to know the median income? Also, is this net or gross? Article talked about paychecks, which could probably mean either. Posted by: Matthew on December 1, 2005 04:36 PM #3 Oh, and also, Felix, presumably the 2.2 million people with jobs in Manhattan don't all live there, so your extrapolation doesn't wash. Posted by: Matthew on December 1, 2005 04:38 PM #4 Obvs mean incomemedian income, and I'd be surprised if more than 40% of Manhattanites made above average. Probably less. But even so. And actually, the fact that there are 2.2 million jobs to 1.5 million people in Manhattan actually only serves to exacerbate the demand-supply imbalance when it comes to real estate. Posted by: Felix on December 1, 2005 04:53 PM #5 I hate to be the one to break this to you, Felix, but nearly all residential housing in Manhattan consists of multi-story buildings. The salary range you describe explains real estate prices in Westchester County, NY and Bergen County, NJ to about the same degree as prices in Manhattan. Posted by: Sterling on December 1, 2005 07:05 PM #6 How delightful that the discussion of property prices one is sometimes unable to defuse at dinner parties just carries on here - almost as if taunting one with its dreary ineluctability. And how nice that Felix should bring along his no doubt expert appreciation of statistical lore. The one thing I am missing is the crucial evaluation of bedbug incidence as it affects property prices in Manhattan. In another thread, Betty has said this bedbug malarkey is all a plan of Bush's. For myself, I prefer to recall that bedbugs tend to originate in Belgium. Schtumm for now. More on this later. Posted by: Claude de Bigny on December 1, 2005 08:40 PM #7 Also, this seems to imply that everyone pays all of their income for housing, which is hopefully not the case. To be more realistic (ignoring the issues rightly brought up by the other commentators, including whether all of those people actually live in Manhattan and whether you can just take the sq ftge of Manhattan as the residential sq ftge), say people on average spend 40% of their income on housing. That gets your income for housing per sq ft to around $151. Posted by: Susan on December 1, 2005 09:14 PM #8 Susan and Sterling, you are embarassingly confused. What percentage of real estate in Manhattan is used for housing? According to this http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/pdf/landusefacts/landuse_tables.pdf (in case you are confused by the graph, the percents sum together veritcally and the land area sum horizontally). And even assuming that all "Mixed Residential and Commercial" was used for housing, less than 38% of the land in Manhattan is for housing. These data certainly allow for the idea that much of rent paid in Manhattan is for commercial use, and even then, a considerable percent is used for public space (Central Park alone is 10% of the area of Manhattan). Anyway, the amount people earn in a particular location is not directly related to the amount the people who live there earn, or the amount the people live there pay for rent. Look at this site: http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/saipe/index.html The direct link is unavailable, but the Median household income for New York County was 43,573. Nassau County on the other hand is more than 71,000. In which place is it cheaper to rent by the foot? Posted by: Andrew on December 2, 2005 07:22 AM #9 I don't think I'm confused. My points are: a) there is actually quite a bit more than 22 square miles of residential floor space in Manhattan because of vertical construction b) a lot of upper-income Manhattan workers live outside Manhattan, and their buying power lifts prices in tony bedroom communities Posted by: Sterling on December 3, 2005 03:38 PM #10 OK, Sterling, let's do it your way. Assume that each of the 1.5 million residents of Manhattan has 400 square feet to call their own: that works out to 1200 square feet for the average family of three and 1600 square feet for the average family of four. Generous, I'd say. That comes out to 600 million square feet of residential real estate in Manhattan. Using that figure, my calculation actually comes out slightly higher : $386 per square foot per year, rather than $378. What makes you think that there's more than 22 square miles of residential floor space in Manhattan? As for your point b, I fail to see how it is in any way germane. Posted by: Felix on December 3, 2005 11:09 PM #11 OK, 22 square miles equals about 613,324,800 square feet. That would leave each of Manhattan's 1.5 million residents with 409 square feet of living space. But I don't believe that most Manhattan residents are actually so deprived, especially when you take into account common areas in apartment buildings such as laundry facilities, hallways, lobbies, etc. I'd be surprised if the average wasn't at least 600, and it's probably more than 800. And besides, that's not what you originally meant - you were dividing Manhattan's land footprint and not taking into account its vertical expansion. As for the second point, I suspect there's a strong tendency among $100,000 - $1,000,000 per annum Manhattan earners - which is well-off to wealthy-on-a-budget - to live in places like Valhalla and Ho-Ho-Kus, especially if they're married with kids. Family-flight in turn increases the average per-capita-square-footage of the Manhattan residential footprint through bleed-off of children. Posted by: Sterling on December 4, 2005 02:29 AM #12 Sterling jumped the shark so long ago it's probably not surprising, but for those of you keeping score at home, he really did just say that the average Manhattanite has 800 square feet of their own. So if you're an average person living with 2 roommates, that means you're in a 2400 square foot apartment. In Manhattan. Yeah. Oh, and that 350 square foot apartment you've got? It's not 350 square feet at all, it's probably more than 4000 square feet. You're just not including the lobby and all the hallways. Posted by: Felix on December 4, 2005 02:43 AM #13 My claim is that the amount of residential-zoned floor space in Manhattan probably works out to between 600 and 800 square feet per resident of Manhattan. You're not only challenging this, but asserting that my claim is absurd. Sure you wanna do that? Posted by: Sterling on December 4, 2005 02:59 AM #14 I've tried to find the statistic, but to no avail. It seems that while office space inventor is measured in square footage, residential space is simply measured, in all documents, by units. But we can work with that. So far I've learned that 82% of zoned lots in Manhattan are residential, making up about 280,000,000 square feet, which includes permanently undeveloped spaces like yards and gardens. If the average height of development across all that land is four stories, then, we're looking at about 750 square feet per person. I've also learned that in 1999 there were about 727,000 residential units in Manhattan , which means that the average unit houses two people. So those three-roomies crammed into one 800-square-foot-tenement-with-the-bathtub-in-the-kitchen examples are mostly fiction. Which is a shame because I get a tingle from the mental picture of Manhattan twenty- and thirty-somethings living in cramped, dingy conditions. If we divide the total residential land area by the total number of units, we get 385 square feet, which works out to 192.5 square feet per person, assuming no dwellings above one story in height and no unimproved/vacant land. If the average height is assumed to be four stories, in this scenario we get about 770 square feet per person. Here's a report from Prudential Douglas Elliman that details its 1Q 2005 sales. Units sold averaged 1,334 square feet, which divided by two yields 767 square feet per person. Breaking it down further we find co-ops averaging 1,197 square feet, condos at 1,496 square feet, luxury at 2,921 and loft at 2,145. So that's 598.5 square feet per person at the low end all the way up to 1,460.5 at the top. There's three separate analytical models for you Felix, all of which yield per-person square footage of 750 or better. I admit they're not all that fleshed out, but I'm stuck inside with a cold watching The Taking of Pelham One-Two-Three on DVD, and I'm disinclined to dig deeper. But you're welcome to. Posted by: Sterling on December 4, 2005 04:04 AM #15 Sterling: do your calculations include infrastructure or is the 280MM number a percentage of raw space? Building density is higher here than anywhere else in America, but 15% to circulation (in buildings and streets themeselves) would be an easily defended metric. Counting hallways in urban residential structures is like counting sidewalks as part of sf for suburban homes. As much Sterling does sound like a set designer for Friends, Felix, I gotta say, of the 25 or so apartments of people that I can definitely make an estimate of size, we average 500 sf easy. Most everyone is a half a standard tenement lot (25 x 25), with a couple of lofts and post-war, large-scale developments thrown in. This is skewed because many of them are single (I live in a 2bd alone) or have rent-controlled apartments from way back. Posted by: 99 on December 4, 2005 07:19 PM #16 Where does your 280m sq ft number come from? Your first two calculations are based on it, so I'd like to know. (They're also based on a multiplier of 4, which as far as I can tell came pretty much out of thin air.) As for apartment sales, in Manhattan individual condos and coops tend to be much larger than the apartments inside rental buildings. So if you look just at sold apartments as opposed to rented apartments, you're going to get a skewed figure. What's more, if a 3800-square-foot brownstone in Harlem, say, is sold and then the downstairs floor is rented out, that still counts as a 3800 square foot deal under these figures. Posted by: Felix on December 4, 2005 09:21 PM #17 The multiplier of 4 was back-of-envelope guess. The 280,000,000 number came from this PDF . Sorry, thought I'd linked to it initially. As for rental apartments being smaller than privately owned condos or co-ops...not sure I buy that. But even if it's true, how much smaller could they be? 10%? Doesn't really matter. You can apologize any time now. Posted by: Sterling on December 4, 2005 10:06 PM #18 if anyone is real curious why not pony up the $250 to get a list of every tax lot in the city? http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/html/bytes/applbyte.shtml in the meantime, simply because i am tired of having to read sterlings pontifications about things he knows anything about, i downloaded a list of all the residential tax lots from 14th street and below from propertyshark. only 14th street and below, because after 6000+ entries, i became bored. 14th street down is a good representative sample of the 99000+ residential tax lots in manhattan. it includes spacious luxury lofts of tribeca, tenements of the les, projects on the eastside, high rise high density battery park and half building condo conversions of downtown (note that a rental bldg with multiple units counts as a single tax lot with the number of units listed as a seperate data field). the average unit size works out to 1100sf with 590sf per person (based 2000 census population stats for 14th st & below). this includes all common space in a building as it is based on total building size for single tax lot (rental) buildings and counts common space tax lots for condo buildings (read lobbies, circ, etc.) multiplying back out by the 2000 census population numbers for manhattan of 1,537,195... we get 906,945,050sf of residential space in manhattan. let's call that an even 9Bsf since the city lists 3800 acres of lot area in manhattan (165,500,000sf), that gives a rough overbuild factor of 5.5. this will obviously skew higher with the ues & uws densities without actually affecting the sf/person. summary- -590sf of residential per person (inclusive of common areas). close to sterlings low estimate of 600, but nowhere near the 800sf -1100sf average size per unit (inclusive of common areas). again close to sterlings guess based on broker mumbojumbo, but still below the stated average. -9Bsf of residential space in manhattan sterling- close on your numbers, but not nearly close enough to be quite so pompously smug. stick to things you know about, like why bush is a foreign policy genius. felix- remind me what this related to? Posted by: geoff on December 5, 2005 12:34 AM #19 Geoff - The only reason I was pompously snug is because Felix had reacted to to my estimates with such comedic outrage. Also, I don't think 14th St. and below is a good representative sample. Newer and I suspect more spacious high-rises make up a much larger proportion of housing from the 30s up through the low 100s. So I'm sticking with 600+. I suspect the actual number is around 750, as stated above. As for your justification of your work - "simply because i am tired of having to read sterlings pontifications about things he knows anything about" - I'm not sure what it means. Perhaps you meant to write "nothing" instead of "anything"? I'm not claiming to be right all the time - I am not right all the time. I am, however, pretty much always right whenever Felix gets all worked up and tells me I have no idea what I'm talking about. Thanks for your small role in marking off another example for me to throw back at him at some future date. Posted by: Sterling on December 5, 2005 06:19 AM #20 Renter-occupied apartments are much smaller than owner-occupied apartments. And as the PDF you yourself linked to shows (see page 24), the vast majority of apartments in Manhattan are renter-occupied. Think about it: one needs maybe 350 sq ft per person to live in some reasonable comfort. Beyond that, you're shelling out extra cash for extra space. Owners are happy doing that because they have 100% equity in that space: everyone has heard the advice that they should buy the biggest apartment they can afford. Renters, on the other hand, are simply giving away thousands of dollars in rent every month, with nothing at all to show for it. So they tend to go not for the biggest apartment they can afford, but rather the cheapest apartment they find adequate. Put it this way: Manhattan is full of individuals spending an enormous proportion of their income on outsize mortgage payments. Almost everyone, when they move from renting to buying, sees their monthly housing costs rise substantially. If you move to Manhattan and have a relatively low income, then you might spend a crazy amount of it on rent, it's true. But if your income is average or higher (and remember that average is $2,025 per week), I very much doubt that your rent is making nearly as much of a dent in your paycheck as it would if you owned your own apartment. You reach a standard of living you're comfortable with, and you stop. Anything beyond that is money which you could otherwise spend on clothes, or travel, or restaurants. Whereas if you buy , you're not spending so much as investing. The only money which you're really spending is the interest on your mortgage -- and even that comes with a tax deduction. Or let's put it another way. That Elliman report you linked to has an average sales price of $1.21 million. A typical rental yield in Manhattan these days is 4%, so if rentals were functionally identical to owner-occupied apartments, which you seem to assume, then the average rent in Manhattan would be over $4,000 a month. In fact, of course, it's nowhere near that. Posted by: Felix on December 5, 2005 06:55 AM #21 There's the shark, and then there's the A train. Sterling's Manhattan clearly stops at 96th street. Sterling, dear, north of that bright white line, the housing stock is incredibly stable and consistent in terms of size and layout. Harlem is just now getting it's first 'luxury' apartment building in a half century. Any larger apartment complexes are housing projects, which have smaller units by definition, and, allowing for the dispersal of the towers in some International Style fantasy also insures that the density does not increase much. Posted by: 99 on December 5, 2005 04:03 PM #22 Felix, just because apartments are currently going for $1.21 million a pop doesn't mean that everyone who owns an apartment paid that much. Rent prices move in sympathy with real estate prices but are less prone to bubbles. What you're missing here, and you've missed the same thing when we've talked about the stock market in the past, is the difference between speculative investors and income investors. Speculators don't buy an apartment (or apartment building) primarily for the benefit of the rent; their main motivation is the hope of flipping the property at some later date for a larger sum than they paid for it. The current Manhattan real estate bubble is the product of speculators. Real estate income investors view rent collection as their goal - most apartment buildings in any town or city in the U.S. are owned by income investors. They get less press than speculators, but they also tend to go bankrupt less often. The market value of a rental property can be determined by the amount of rent it generates for the owner, not the other way around. Manhattan rents are high - probably even ludicrously high - but that is a function of large demand chasing relatively low supply, and is only weakly related to current real estate prices. I do acknowledge your point about space not being a priority for Manhattan renters, there is some truth in that. People who do see space as a necessity tend to wind up in rental units in Brooklyn, Queens or Hudson County. But that's not exclusively the case. Posted by: Sterling on December 5, 2005 04:59 PM #23 This thread is hilarious and sad, although a good example of how the same statistics can be applied to support any and all political positions. Posted by: sac on December 5, 2005 06:39 PM #24 Sterling, Manhattan is the one real-estate market in the US where there are, to all intents and purposes, zero speculators under your definition. No one buys Manhattan property in order to flip it. For one thing, co-op boards (and even condo boards, for that matter) hate flippers, and are likely to punish them. There's flip taxes, brokers' fees of 6% for the seller, and a luxury tax of 1% on any apartment over $1m for the buyer. Prices are so high that the carrying costs are enormous -- and you can't rent out the apartment in the meantime, because that makes it pretty much unsaleable. There are, of course, lots of buildings owned by income investors in New York. Most of the East Village, where I live, is comprised of such buildings: they normally have 20 or so apartments (say 5 floors, 4 apartments per floor), and they've been going up in price almost as much as individual apartments have -- the only reason they haven't gone up just as much is because many of the tenants are rent-controlled or rent-stabilised below market. These are typical New York apartments, from a renter's point of view -- but I can tell you, as someone who was apartment hunting in the East Village for almost a year, they're much less typical from an owner's point of view. Also, there's a strong incentive for for-sale apartments to be as large as possible: price per square foot is positively correlated with size. That's not the case in the rental market: it's easier to rent out a 650sqft apartment for $2500 than it is to rent out a 1300sqft apartment for $5000. Posted by: Felix on December 5, 2005 09:14 PM #25 "Manhattan is the one real-estate market in the US where there are, to all intents and purposes, zero speculators under your definition. No one buys Manhattan property in order to flip it." Felix, of course people speculate on property in Manhattan. Just because the barriers to entry are high doesn't mean some won't jump them. How else do you think a modest apartment winds up costing as much as a dozen Mercedes-Benz CL500s? Who do you imagine is providing demand at that level? You know banks are not issuing $1,000,000 mortgages to households with joint incomes of $200,000. It's trust fund kiddies - who are often divorced from fiscal reality - and speculators. As for your point about different-sized apartments being suitable for rent versus sale, I might agree with you except for the fact that every rental apartment IS OWNED by someone. It IS PART of the for sale market. I'd be surprised if fewer than half of the condos in Manhattan are rented out by their owners. Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 01:51 AM #26 Sterling, I'm afraid the factors leading to high apartment prices are much more mundane than your feverish mind would like to imagine. Lots of global liquidity, driving down interest rates and banks' credit tests. Lots of demand, due to Manhattan's status as the center of the universe and high Wall Street bonuses. And very limited supply. The market for flippers is Miami, not NYC -- where a condo can be bought and sold three or four times before it is even built. As for your point about rental apartments being owned by someone, it sounds clever until you stop to think about what I've already said. Rental buildings are owned by landlords; the vast majority of condos and co-ops are owner-occupied. For one thing, co-ops vastly outnumber condos, and they're hard to rent. And as for condos, they generally get rented out when they're not the place their owner really wants to live. Given how valuable they are, few owners who don't want to live here would rather rent out their condos rather than simply sell them. Take my East Village condo building, for instance: when it went condo in 1983, only one owner lived here. Today, all the units bar one are owner-occupied. I haven't done my homework on this, but I'll happily accept your wager: I'll bet the standard bottle of vintage champagne that more than half the condos in Manhattan are owner-occupied. Deal? Posted by: Felix on December 6, 2005 02:43 AM #27 If you go double or nothing on the proposition that the amount of existing residential floor space in Manhattan divided by the number of residents of Manhattan is equal to or greater than 600 sq. ft., then it's a bet. How are we going to research this? FWIW, I am descended from a man who is reputed to be the first person to negotiate a real estate deal in New York: Wessel Wesselse (ten Broek). He may have been the man to offer 60 guilders (often misreported as $24) as the purchase price of Manhattan from the Canarsies. (Technically the Canarsies didn't own Manhattan Island - it's not for nothing that "Canarsie" is in Brooklyn. Also technically the Dutch West India Company didn't care which tribe owned it. It just needed some bunch of natives to smile and sign off on the deal to keep the English away.) This of course conveys no special knowledge upon me, but it certainly adds a humorous subtext to our disagreement. Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 04:14 AM #28 I'm not sure about the terms of the wager: we seem to be betting on two different things at the same time. But spell it out, and I'll be amenable. I do want to ensure, of course, that hallways and elevator shafts and the like do not count as residential floor space. And please also ensure that if one of the propositions can be determined while the other one can't, then the other wager still stands. Posted by: Felix on December 6, 2005 05:55 AM #29 I'm not sure how we could specify the terms to exclude elevators if they are included in filings. However, it occurs to me that Manhattan Borough probably requires a statement of total dwelling space for its Certificate of Occupancy, so that would work for me. And no, I think double or nothing sounds good to me, especially since we will be attempting to falsify two of my estimations, rather than either of yours. Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 06:20 AM #30 You've lost me, I'm afraid. When you say "double or nothing", are you proposing a 2BVC bet on the residential floor space, and no bet at all on the proportion of condos which are rented out? Or what? It makes no sense to me: "double or nothing" normally happens after A has lost a bet and B has won it. Then going double or nothing means that either B wins double the original amount, or he wins nothing. You essentially run the bet over again. Are you maybe trying to propose something whereby if I lose I lose 2BVCs, and if I win I win nothing? Posted by: Felix on December 6, 2005 07:44 AM #31 Are you trying to squirm out of it? Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 06:03 PM #32 Sterling, will you propose your bet already? I've already said that I'm likely to accept. Just tell me the terms! Posted by: Felix on December 6, 2005 06:12 PM #33 I did! Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 06:25 PM #34 OK, have a few moments now, I had to get someplace before 2pm and the roads are crap with snow and slush. Um, OK. My terms for the bet is those two things specified, avg. sq. footage = 600 and = 50% of condos. Either side has to get both right to collect. gotta run Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 06:51 PM #35 So if one of us gets both right, he wins 1BVC or 2BVCs? And if one of the two turns out to be unverifiable, then it's a wash? Posted by: Felix on December 6, 2005 07:22 PM #36 Honestly, Felix, I doubt either number is verifiable. Like I wrote above, the city appears to track residential rental inventory by units, rather than by square footage. Also, most owners of condominium units who rent them out do so through agents - even the tenant may be only vaguely aware of the legal status of the unit. In NJ I don't think an individual condo owner even needs to report the unit as a rental property if it's in a building that's already inspected under multi-family housing regulations (or if it's a standalone unit or duplex). The rent revenue has to be reported as taxable income, naturallly, but not to any entity with housing oversight. So make it for one bottle and yes both figures have to be verifiable. That said, if either of us can show a grouping of not-completely-conclusive figures from multiple sources that seem reasonable and fall long or short of my guesses by ten percent or more, then I think we should accept them. (Of course, I have arguably already met this condition with my square footage prediction, and Geoff's calculations don't contradict it under the 10% rule I suggest.) Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 10:05 PM #37 as i mentioned earlier, you can get the sf and unit count for every residential tax lot in the city from the cities web site... google 'bytes of the big apple' and look at the 'pluto' product. the license fee is $250 or you can get the info from propertyshark.com. there are 99000+ listings for manhattan. at 100 listings per page, thats a lot of cutting and pasting into excel. both of these will give you tax lot sizes (whole buildings/unit count or condo unit), which will be inclusive of common area. 10-15% is considered a fairly standard deduction for circulation. mechanical space is not included in the floor area count. happy dueling Posted by: geoff on December 6, 2005 10:29 PM Post a comment Name: Email Address: URL: Remember personal info? Yes No Anti-spam question: Share four cupcakes equally among four people. How many does each person get (in digits)? Comments: XML Atom RSS 2.0 RSS 1.0 Sources Eurof Felix Jame Michelle Mike Sage7 Stefan Sterling &c. Disclaimer Archive 12/05 11/05 10/05 09/05 08/05 07/05 06/05 05/05 04/05 03/05 02/05 01/05 12/04 11/04 10/04 09/04 08/04 07/04 06/04 05/04 04/04 03/04 02/04 01/04 12/03 11/03 10/03 09/03 Old site Recent posts 08/12: Not man enough (1) 08/12: Fare's fair (0) 07/12: Briddishisms (5) 06/12: The Trial of Saddam (5) 05/12: Leg deficiencies (4) 01/12: New York real-estate prices explained (37) 30/11: Bad vibe (22) 30/11: Thick-headed bouncers (0) 29/11: Argentina's sinister move (2) 28/11: Bedbugs and the city (8) 27/11: I've got a fast card (1) 22/11: Pedestrianize Broadway! (5) 19/11: Century 21 the next casualty at Ground Zero? (23) 19/11: Johnny Depp - sunshine traitor (4) 18/11: Gawker F***** by Yahoo! (7) Comments 06/12: geoff: as i mentioned earlier, you can get the sf and unit count for every residential tax lot in the ci 06/12: Sterling: Honestly, Felix, I doubt either number is verifiable. Like I wrote above, the city appears to tr 06/12: Felix: So if one of us gets both right, he wins 1BVC or 2BVCs? And if one of the two turns out to be unv 06/12: Sterling: OK, have a few moments now, I had to get someplace before 2pm and the roads are crap with snow an 06/12: Sterling: I did! 06/12: Felix: Sterling, will you propose your bet already? I've already said that I'm likely to accept. Just te 06/12: Sterling: Are you trying to squirm out of it? 06/12: Felix: You've lost me, I'm afraid. When you say "double or nothing", are you proposing a 2BVC bet on the 06/12: Sterling: I'm not sure how we could specify the terms to exclude elevators if they are included in filings. 06/12: Felix: I'm not sure about the terms of the wager: we seem to be betting on two different things at the s 06/12: Sterling: If you go double or nothing on the proposition that the amount of existing residential floor spac 06/12: Felix: Sterling, I'm afraid the factors leading to high apartment prices are much more mundane than your 06/12: Sterling: "Manhattan is the one real-estate market in the US where there are, to all intents and purposes, 05/12: Felix: Sterling, Manhattan is the one real-estate market in the US where there are, to all intents and p 05/12: sac: This thread is hilarious and sad, although a good example of how the same statistics can be appli 05/12: Sterling: Felix, just because apartments are currently going for $1.21 million a pop doesn't mean that ever 05/12: 99: There's the shark, and then there's the A train. Sterling's Manhattan clearly stops at 96th stree 05/12: Felix: Renter-occupied apartments are much smaller than owner-occupied apartments. And as the < 05/12: Sterling: Geoff - The only reason I was pompously snug is because Felix had reacted to to my estimates with 05/12: geoff: if anyone is real curious why not pony up the $250 to get a list of every tax lot in the city?<br 04/12: Sterling: The multiplier of 4 was back-of-envelope guess. The 280,000,000 number came from <a href 04/12: Felix: Where does your 280m sq ft number come from? Your first two calculations are based on it, so I'd 04/12: 99: Sterling: do your calculations include infrastructure or is the 280MM number a percentage of raw 04/12: Sterling: I've tried to find the statistic, but to no avail. It seems that while office space inventor is 04/12: Sterling: My claim is that the amount of residential-zoned floor space in Manhattan probably works out to b 04/12: Felix: Sterling jumped the shark so long ago it's probably not surprising, but for those of you keeping 04/12: Sterling: OK, 22 square miles equals about 613,324,800 square feet. That would leave each of Manhattan's 1 03/12: Felix: OK, Sterling, let's do it your way. Assume that each of the 1.5 million residents of Manhattan ha 03/12: Sterling: I don't think I'm confused. My points are: a) there is actually quite a bit more than 22 02/12: Andrew: Susan and Sterling, you are embarassingly confused. What percentage of real estate in Manhattan i Trackbacks

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Amazon.com: Real Estate Finance and Investment Manual: Books Your Store Books See All 32 Product Categories Your Account | Cart | Wish List | Help | Advanced Search | Browse Subjects | Bestsellers | The New York Times® Best Sellers | Magazines | Corporate Accounts | Amazon Shorts | Bargain Books | Used Books | Textbooks Search Amazon.com Books Web Search Join Amazon Prime and ship Two-Day for free and Overnight for $3.99. Already a member? Sign in . or Sign in to turn on 1-Click ordering. A9.com users save 1.57% on Amazon. Learn how . More Buying Choices 51 used & new from $13.88 Have one to sell? See larger image Share your own customer images Publisher: learn how customers can search inside this book. Real Estate Finance and Investment Manual (Paperback) by Jack Cummings (7 customer reviews) List Price: $34.95 Price: $23.07 & eligible for FREE Super Saver Shipping on orders over $25. See details You Save: $11.88 (34%) Availability: Usually ships within 24 hours. 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Total List Price: $54.90 Buy Together Today: $36.64 Customers who bought this book also bought What Every Real Estate Investor Needs to Know About Cash Flow...And 36 Other Key FInancial Measures: Guidelines, Formulas, and Rules of Thumb for Making Money in Real Estate by Frank Gallinelli The Complete Guide to Real Estate Finance for Investment Properties: How to Analyze Any Single-Family, Multifamily, or Commercial Property by Steve Berges The McGraw-Hill 36-Hour Real Estate Investment Course by Jack Cummings Commercial Real Estate Investing 12 Easy Steps to Getting Started by Jack Cummings Investing in Real Estate With Other People's Money: 100s of Insider Strategies for Turning a Small Investment into a Fortune by Jack Cummings Explore Similar Items : in Books Product Details Paperback: 550 pages Publisher: Prentice Hall; Revised edition (April, 1997) Language: English ISBN: 0134933885 Product Dimensions: 9.2 x 7.0 x 1.6 inches Shipping Weight: 2.3 pounds. ( View shipping rates and policies ) Average Customer Review: based on 7 reviews. ( Write a review. ) Amazon.com Sales Rank: Today: #33,828 in Books Yesterday: #178,763 in Books (Publishers and authors: improve your sales ) Other Editions: Hardcover (Revised) | All Editions Citations ( learn more ) 1 book that cites this book: Profitable Real Estate Investing : Making Big Money, Finding the Right Properties, Investing on a Shoestring by Roger Woodsonin Back Matter Customers interested in this title may also be interested in: Sponsored Links: What is this? Investment Manual Regulation of Investment Advisers 2005 Edition Only $396.50 Today west.thomson.com Real Estate Rehab Funding 100% REI financing of purchase and repairs for rehab homes. 65% ARV www.rehabfunding.com Investment Property Loan Purchase or refinance investment property. No brokering accepted. www.USLandlord.com Feedback Customers who viewed this book also viewed Investing in Real Estate, Fourth Edition by Andrew James McLean Financing Secrets of a Millionaire Real Estate Investor by William Bronchick The Pre-Foreclosure Property Investor's Kit : How to Make Money Buying Distressed Real Estate -- Before the Public Auction by Thomas Lucier Real Estate Finance & Investments + Excel templates CD-ROM (Real Estate Finance and Investments) by William B Brueggeman Real Estate Finance and Investments with CD and Powerweb (Real Estate Finance and Investments) by William B Brueggeman Explore Similar Items : in Books Spotlight Reviews Write an online review and share your thoughts with other customers. 80 of 81 people found the following review helpful: Good for individual investors, less useful for professionals , December 30, 1999 Reviewer: A J Southwell (Nashville, TN) - See all my reviews Focused on real estate deals in the <$2MM category, this book offers a treasure trove of helpful tips about how to work the angles to create maximum wealth from real estate investing. Especially useful are sections on goal-setting, negotiating, dealing with banks, and secondary financing. The book is less useful for development professionals dealing with larger developments such as office buildings, apartment communities, etc, as it omits extended discussion of the institutional players. Both individuals and development professionals will find Zuckerman, Real Estate Investment and Acquisition Workbook a useful adjunct, with development professionals perhaps more intested in Brueggeman & Fisher, Real Estate Finance and Investments than this offering. Was this review helpful to you? ( Report this ) 10 of 10 people found the following review helpful: Solid , April 26, 2004 Reviewer: J. Daily (Fort Worth, Tx United States) - See all my reviews Cummings is one of my favorite R.E. authors. He is very thorough. This one has chapters on conventional and creative financing, tax exchanges, land development, discounting mortgages, sale-leasebacks, how to get started and even dealing with foreclosure. Table of contents is very thorough and makes it very easy to go to the exact page you want to to find specific information. He is good with the numbers and doesnt leave much to the imagination like many authors do. I recommend anything by this author. Was this review helpful to you? ( Report this ) Customer Reviews Average Customer Review: Write an online review and share your thoughts with other customers. 23 of 24 people found the following review helpful: Excellent "Creative Real Estate Financing" manual , February 18, 2002 Reviewer: This "no-nonsense" book, by a seasoned investor and broker, is mostly focused on non-traditional real estate financing vehicles. Bits and pieces on the subject have previously taught by various gurus, but this book covers ALL of them. If every Realtor and investor read this, we would all be better off. Other recommended RE investing reads: The Unofficial Guide to Real Estate Investing Landlording by Leigh Robinson 5 Magic Paths to Making a Fortune In Real Estate Investing The Income Stream by Robt. Goodman Was this review helpful to you? ( Report this ) 19 of 19 people found the following review helpful: Solid, comprehensive, but a bit verbose , January 5, 2002 Reviewer: C Boyle (Long Beach, CA) - See all my reviews This and Landlording, by Leigh, are my two fave's so far as a real estate investor. This one tends towards overkill with many, many examples but other readers may want that more than I did. There are one or two strategy recommendations I disagree with rather heartily, but it's clear, pretty much accurate, and very readable. The no-nonsense writing reminds me a bit of T. Dallow or J. Reed, both also recommended. Was this review helpful to you? ( Report this ) 7 of 24 people found the following review helpful: Great book, but overpriced , February 19, 2000 Reviewer: John M Garrett (Lake of the Ozarks) - See all my reviews Great book, easy to read, too pricy Was this review helpful to you? ( Report this ) 7 of 9 people found the following review helpful: Rock Solid Info on Finance Structure , December 5, 1999 Reviewer: PeteH (NYC) - See all my reviews Cummings brings 30+ years of creative RE finance experience to bear with specific examples of techniques that the average buyer/investor won't be familiar with but that work in the real world (particularly with commercial property). Could have used one more round of proofreading, but well worth studying just to expand your awareness of how to acquire property and how to get the best price when selling. Was this review helpful to you? ( Report this ) See all 7 customer reviews... Listmania! Earn real money in real estate : A list by Lisa Banghart Real Estate Books : A list by "universal_tech" Real Estate : A list by Ahsen Abro Create a Listmania! list So You'd Like to... Work Less and Earn More : A guide by carlamarie , Business Guru take another look-see IV : A guide by Melody Davis , mostly do-it-yourself style books give MOM'S MILLION DOLLAR BATH (for $99). : A guide by Jenni Moore , wife, mom, "kid sister" to 3 big brothers Create a So You'd Like to... guide Look for similar items by category Subjects > Business & Investing > General Subjects > Business & Investing > Industries & Professions > Real Estate > General Subjects > Business & Investing > Industries & Professions > Real Estate > Investments Subjects > Business & Investing > Industries & Professions > Real Estate > Mortgages Look for similar items by subject Business & Economics Business / Economics / Finance Business/Economics Finance Handbooks, manuals, etc Mortgage loans Real Estate - General Real Estate - Investments Real Estate - Mortgages Real estate business Real estate investment i.e., each book must be in subject 1 AND subject 2 AND ... 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House Rent

Stamford Hill Flat or House to rent or buy. Stamford Hill Flats or Houses to rent or buy. Letting, Sales and Estate Agents. Holiday, Accommodation, Flat, Studio, Home, House or Apartment to rent, let or buy, real estate to rent, let or for sale Stamford Hill N15 Area 3 Map All Area Map Click here to let all Estate Agents and Letting Agents know "I am looking to rent or buy property in Stamford Hill" Rent Guide Stamford Hill Weekly From To Studio £100 £240 1 Bed £120 £275 2 Bed £170 £425 3 Bed £230 £475 Monthly From To Studio £433 £1040 1 Bed £520 £1192 2 Bed £737 £1842 3 Bed £997 £2058 Travel Guide Transport: Stamford Hill Journey Time: ~ 20 mins Area Road Map Other useful links Further Area Info ... Premium Estates Agents and Letting Agents in Stamford Hill Lees Lettings Estates Agents and Letting Agents in Stamford Hill Fab Homes Abba Property Stamford Hill N15 Area Comments large Victorian and Edwardian terraces which are much sought after as family homes. Still largely urban, rather than suburban in character, large council blocks still blight the area although many are now making way for better quality low rise developments. Council Tax Hackney Year-Band A B C D E F G H 2004/2005 £814 £950 £1085 £1221 £1493 £1764 £2035 £2442 2003/2004 £772 £901 £1030 £1158 £1416 £1673 £1931 £2317 2002/2003 £682 £796 £909 £1023 £1250 £1478 £1705 £2046 This page enables you to link to Estate Agents in Stamford Hill and Letting Agents in Stamford Hill to find a flat or house for rent or to let or buy. If you wish to find flats to rent in Stamford Hill or houses for sale in Stamford Hill then the Estate Agent, Letting Agent and Property Consultants shown above can cater for your various needs. The Lettings and Estate Agents in Stamford Hill, N15, are not shown in any preferential order, except by Premium Agents. You can also use our popular feature Click here to let all agents shown above know that "I am Looking in Stamford Hill" to save time and send a single email with your requirements to all the Stamford Hill Estate Agents shown.This entry form will allow you to get your requirements to multiple Lettings and Estate Agents quickly and at the same time. Do you want a house/flat/apartment or studio flat in Stamford Hill? If you want to move to Stamford Hill as an executive or a professional with a family, or you are a student finding somewhere for the first time.The "I am Looking in Stamford Hill" is perfect for you. You can contact many Estate Agents on one go. To help make your responses from agents better you must let the Estate Agent know as much of your requirements as possible including yourbudget, required location(s), furnished or unfurnished, move in date required, tenancy period and any other requirements that you feel are important. Estate Agents and Lettings Agents You Could Be Advertising On This Stamford Hill Estate Agent page. As you will read on this page property and agency searchers use this well established service to send you their requirements. The service and this website are free to use for home buyers and people looking to rent property. If you wish to be included in the list of agents shown above you should contact us. You can start the contact process by clicking here . Looking in Stamford Hill for a place to rent. A room in a flatshare, or house share, a room in a Stamford Hill home. You may wish to review the Stamford Hill Property to Let that the Estate Agents have to offer or you can check out some more specific links with our flatshare, houseshare, a roomshare specialist. Click here to go see our property sharing section Looking for Stamford Hill commercial premises or an industrial unit in Stamford Hill. You may wish to review the Stamford Hill Commercial Property that the Commercial Agents have to offer or you can check out some more specific links with our Commercial page which shows Estate Agency and Lettings Agency offering serviced offices, offices, workshops, studios, live/work, shops, factory space, industrial units and warehouses. Click here to go see our commercial page By letting lots of agents know what you are looking for you can get a good selection of property in Stamford Hill to choose from. Many Estate Agents in Stamford Hill enter into Sole Agency agreements with Vendors and as such that really good property may only appear on that agents books. It may be the Stamford Hill property you have been looking for. So why not use our innovative feature now. Affiliates Flat & House Sharing Property Searches [ Home ] [ FAQ ] [ About Us ] [ Disclaimer ] [ Advertise ] [ Agents ] [ Email Webmaster ] Powered by PCHomes & EstatesIT.Net from Estates IT Limited © 1996-2005

home mortgage loans, including

FRB: Understanding the Home Mortgage Process Where to Shop and What to Look For Skip to content The Mortgage Application Process Understanding Your Rights to Fair Lending Directory of Federal Agencies Mortgage home Once you have found the home of your choice, you may think that your shopping days are over. Actually, only the first phase has been completed. Next comes finding a mortgage and payment terms that fit your budget. Where you shop and what you look for are important. You might start by looking for a mortgage at the bank where you have your checking or savings account. But don’t limit yourself. A wide variety of institutions make home mortgage loans, including savings and loan associations, commercial banks, mutual savings banks, and mortgage companies. The mortgages these institutions offer will have varying features. One way to find the creditor with the most attractively priced loan is to look in your local newspaper; check to see if it publishes a shoppers guide to mortgage credit. These shoppers guides are available in many localities and can be used to identify the lenders with low rates. But, basically, the way to find the loan with the most attractive terms is to shop around. You should have in mind some of the things to look for in a mortgage loan. For example, what types of loans are available from a given institution? Does the lender make privately or federally insured or guaranteed loans? Some lenders offer mortgage loans backed by a federal agency such as the Federal Housing Administration (FHA loans) or the Department of Veterans Affairs (VA loans). Loans that are not government-insured are called conventional mortgages. Insured mortgages may be more attractive than conventional mortgages in some ways--such as lower down payment requirements. But they may be more restrictive in other ways; for example, they may be available only for certain kinds of homes, or for properties whose value is below a specified price. Other factors important to your mortgage decision are the length of the loan and the down payment required by the lender. The longer the term and the larger the down payment, the smaller your monthly payments will be. The interest rate is important too, and in some cases the amount of the down-payment will influence the interest rate that you pay (the larger the down payment, the lower the interest rate). In addition, mortgage loans may have interest rates that will stay fixed for the life of the loan (fixed-rate mortgages), that may change (adjustable-rate mortgages, or ARMs), or that represent a combination of fixed and variable rates (convertible mortgages). The initial rate of an ARM is generally lower than the rate available on a fixed-rate mortgage; but remember, the rate may change during the lifetime of the loan. Don’t hesitate to ask the lender how one loan differs from another, how the different features of the loan will affect the mortgage, or whether your chances to qualify would improve if you made a higher down payment. When you're shopping around, you will find that some home mortgage lenders have special programs to assist veterans and low-income or first-time homebuyers. Ask the lender if such programs are available. Home | Brochures Accessibility To comment on this site, please fill out our feedback form. Last update: June 21, 2001

home for sale, historic

Historic Homes for Sale, Historic Real Estate & Property for Sale in the United States @ PreservationDirectory.com Historic preservation homes for sale, historic home for sale, historic house for sale, historic property for sale, historic real estate for sale, and preservation home for sale. Last Updated: December 23, 2005 View wonderful historic homes and property for sale and rent throughout the United States by clicking on the map below. Each historic property for is listed on its own page, complete with multiple photos, full description and history of the property, complete contact information for seller/rental organization, and much more. For information on listing your historic home(s) for sale, please click here . NEW - Historic rental properties are now being listed. Now you can view historic apartments and homes for rent, historic event rentals (for weddings, business meetings, and other functions), and office space for lease. To view the historic rental properties, please click the link next to the map below. The listings for historic homes & real estate for sale and rent in the United States & Canada are currently divided by region - to view listings, please click the geographic region header or appropriate area on the map below: * New Listings Click above to view new listings added in the last 2 months! 1. Northeast : CT, MA, ME, NH, NY, RI, VT 2. Mid-Atlantic: DC, DE, MD, NJ, PA, VA, WV 3. Southeast : AL, FL, GA, LA, MS, NC, SC 4. Mid-Central: KY, OH, IL, IN, MI, TN 5, Upper Midwest : IA, MN, ND, NE, SD, WI 6. Lower Midwest: AR, KS, MO, OK, TX 7. West : AK, AZ, CA, CO, HI, ID, MT, NM, NV, OR, UT, WA, WY 8. CANADA : View listings for Provinces in Canada * Historic Rentals Click here to view historic rental properties. Click link below for information on listing your historic property for sale or rent CLICK HERE FOR CANADA LISTINGS Featured Historic Home for Sale: The Allen-Beville House Douglaston, NY (click link to view) Historical Holiday Gala...See the Beville House dressed for the holidays...Candle light tour with cocktail reception culiminating at a second historical landmark...This fundraising event to raise preservation awareness is planned at the Estate on December 11, 2005 from 5:30-8:30pm EST. All proceeds from the event will benefit the Douglaston Little Neck Historical Society. To read the full event details, please click here . Interested in receiving regular email updates of new additions to the "Historic Real Estate for Sale & Rent" directory? Receive an electronic newsletter each 6 weeks that will display the new historic homes and buildings for sale that have been recently added to PreservationDirectory.com. CLICK HERE to be added to the "Historic Real Estate for Sale & Rent " Email Update List. Feedback from those listing their Historic Property on PreservationDirectory.com: "I think your site is unique among what I was able to find on the Web, and a great service. Not everyone wants a historic house with the accompanying challenges. Your site helps house owners seeking to sell or rent their property a means to directly target the audience that will recognize the unique charms of a historic property." - Mary Traeger Pascale, Waterview Historic Gem, Keyport, NJ " PreservationDirectory.com provides a unique venue for owners to build visibility and identify qualified, willing and able buyers in this specialty segment of the market that few real estate organizations can match." - Andrew Bulla , The Stone House in Pine Valley, McKnightstown, PA Thanks for all your help. Please put a sold sign on the ad so we will stop getting calls. They're still coming in. Your site has been a huge help to us. We really appreciate what the site did for us. Thanks again. - Debbie Ward, Prudential Carolinas Realty "Thanks for your quality editing and presentation. My listing with you has yielded much more interesting and serious prospects than my more expensive listing with [other prominent online services]. I am recommending PreservationDirectory.com to others I know. It is an excellent website and all of the seriously interested responses came from this connection, and some traveled long distances to see the house." - Nancy Stillians, The Stillians House, Villisca, IA " Thanks for your help. The website is a good one and I have advised several people to use it. I think it offers a quality alternative to other online services. I really appreciate the professionalism represented in the website and I especially enjoy the "depth" of listings and the history they represent. " - Frank Brough, Hale's Riverfront Homestead, Mosheim, TN "It was definitely a positive experience dealing with your organization. I have had numerous hits from your site. I sold it through a local realtor, but feel your website was very successful in getting responses. Thanks again!" - Robbie Blake, Blake Real Estate, Bronson, FL What qualifies a home, lodge, warehouse, mill, lookout tower, etc. as being a historic property? The only universally agreed-upon criteria appears to be the property being 50 years old or older, which is what we are using for this directory. The degree of further "historical significance" then depends on a multitude of factors, including if the structure is representative of an architectural style, its association with a locally or nationally famous event or person, or being located within the boundaries of a local or national historic district, to name a few. Using various methods of research, information can be gathered that will help to piece together the story of your home. For more information on your home and researching its history, contact your local historical non-profit organization or the Local, State or Federal government department that is charged with historic preservation and/or cultural resource management. These preservation groups and programs may be listed in our "Preservation Organizations" directory Please note: As more historic real estate is added to the directory, the categories will become more specific (ie. by State, rather than a large geographic region). Also, we will soon institute a more comprehensive search capability, allowing you to search by such elements as architectural style, sell price, date built, house dimensions, etc. Please note: All information provided on each listing has been provider by the seller. We cannot verify the information provided - please contact the seller/agent with all questions you may have about the historic home or property for sale. Map courtesy of Collectics Antiques & Collectibles Email: preservationdirectory@comcast.net Best Viewed at 800x600 pixels in Internet Explorer 2000-2005 PreservationDirectory.com, All Rights Reserved.