Real Estate Prices

Real estate - Boston.com Buying Renting Recent Sales Place an ad Luxury Living Community data Mortgage Commercial Moving Guides Real estate Boston.com Check out the Real estate Section on Boston.com. December 29, 2005 -- Skyline at Station Landing Starting at: $339,000 Allston 2 bedroom $384,390 Newport 1 bed/1 den $755,000 Quechee Lakes, VT 3 bedroom $455,000 Sugarbush, VT 2 bedroom $166,457 Loon Mountain, N.H. Now accepting reservations Newbury 4 bedroom $749,900 Malden 2 bedroom $314,900 The Grandview Starting at: $600,000 Swampscott 3 bedroom $329,000 Boston 2 bedroom $545,000 South Boston 3 bedroom $429,000 Needham 4 bedroom $1,195,000 Dorchester 2 bedroom $314,000 York Beach, ME 3 bedroom $629,000 Battery Wharf Starting at: $1.15MM 210 South Street Regatta Residences Rooney Real Estate NOTE: We are experiencing technical problems that are preventing some photos from appearing in our listings. We are working now to correct the problem. We apologize for the inconvenience and thank you for using Boston.com Real Estate. Homes New developments Condominiums Open houses Get started All rentals Apt. communities Vacation rentals Get started HOME OF THE WEEK Old styles in a bustling area Amid a neighborhood becoming known for new restaurants, shops, and condos, the residential block where this narrow, four-level home sits may be one of the few things that has yet to significantly change. Homes of the week: Watertown | Sudbury | Westminster See photos of this home Brockton builds on legacy This working-class city's once moribund downtown is being revived by young professionals drawn to the industrial chic of old factories where laborers plied their trade more than a century ago. (The Boston Globe, 12/25/05) Kerouac's Cape home up for sale ON LOCATION Historic cottage for sale The Pratt House in Northampton, which was commissioned in 1859 by Boston doctor Alvah Littlefield and once faced demolition, is now on the market for $1.285 million. (The Boston Globe, 12/25/05) GALLERY Editor's picks: On the market Check out our favorites this week and see all different sizes, shapes, prices, and locations. (Boston.com) Last week's picks METRO HOME FEATURE A safe haven Several designers donated their time and expertise to decorate 13 bedrooms and living areas at a Children's Hospital shelter. (Metro Boston, 12/16/05) See photos of the hospital makeovers Submit photos of your pad to be featured More in Home MESSAGE BOARDS Where are prices headed? Open house advice Things to consider when buying View all message boards NEWS From one generation to another A group of young developers felt a need to give back to their Jewish community in a way that has never been done before. (Boston Globe, 12/18/05) Formal room is hereupon retired Office market shows signs of rebound COMMUNITY SNAPSHOT Holbrook Holbrook offers a mix of properties for first-time home buyers seeking more affordable options and for those in the market for more high-end housing. (The Boston Globe, 12/25/05) More profiles: Hingham | Somerville | Wellesley | Southborough All Community statistics and town data | Compare towns GALLERY A look at Manny's condo Boston.com toured Ramirez's penthouse condo, on sale for $6.9 million, and caught a glimpse into the daily digs of the World Series MVP. (Boston.com) Alternatives to heating See what others are doing to cut down on their heating bill this winter. (Boston.com) Cost comparison What is your home heating plan? Heating tips Q&A about your home heating bills More in home heating NEWS Sellers chop prices as market slows Boston-area homeowners trying to sell their houses are sharply reducing asking prices -- in some cases, by $100,000 or more -- in response to a sudden slowdown. (By Kimberly Blanton, Boston Globe) Holiday season is the ideal time to buy Lilly's five steps to real estate success 14 tips to finding a great apartment Need some help finding your next new pad? Here are a few items you should make sure to check for. (Boston.com) Print the list A sense of community in a rental Sept. 1 moving scenes Self-storage how-to Step-by-step moving guide Print box labels What are your tips for moving? Pointers on renting, your rights and so much more Search rentals Renting guides NEWS Rises in rent outpace some wages The cost of rental housing has increased more rapidly than have wages, making it increasingly difficult for low-income families to afford even modest apartments. (By Stephen Ohlemacher, Boston Globe) Tools and calculators Run the numbers on everything from your income to upfront costs and credit. Instant mortgage quotes Mortgage rates 30-yr Fxd: 6.30% 15-yr Fxd: 5.85% 1-yr. ARM: 5.15% Mortgage quotes Daily commentary NEWS Real estate slump chills 'flippers' Get in, get out, get the next deal. That's the code of the ''flipper." Flipping -- buying and quickly reselling homes -- has helped some investors make a killing over the past few years in markets such as the North Shore. Selling a house? Try some entertainment 10 things you must do when selling 10 tips for hiring a broker Selling or renting your property? click here Latest articles: Real estate transactions ( Boston Globe, 12/29/05 ) A term every home buyer, real estate agent, homeowner should know (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) Dry rot leaves home buyer in the gutter (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) Home sellers beware: Undisclosed info comes back to bite (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) In bankruptcy sale, must co-owner pay 50 percent of expenses? (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) ENeighborhoods exec. has roots in real estate technology (Inman, 12/28/05) Visions of gold entice a tin city (Boston Globe, 12/28/05) Government requirements for disclosure fail to make the grade (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) Electrical panel requires upgrading (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) Should landlords rent to section 8 subsidized tenants? (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) 'House Poor' a profitable read for home buyers (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) Inside capital gains tax law for real estate (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) Ensuring home's proper ventilation (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) America closes doors to architectural expression (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) 5 negotiation tactics for real estate deals (Inman, 1:06 p.m.) HOME OF THE WEEK: Old styles inside, bustling outside (Boston Globe, 12/25/05) ON LOCATION: Historic cottage escaped demolition, now it's a gem for sale (Boston Globe, 12/25/05) BUSINESS LETTERS: Home prices are falling, but why? (Boston Globe, 12/25/05) Brockton builds on factory legacy (Boston Globe, 12/25/05) COMMUNITY SNAPSHOT: Holbrook (Boston Globe, 12/25/05) feedback form | help | site index | globe archives | rss © 20 The New York Times Company

Purchase Property

Home Buying - Home Buying and Home Selling Advice - Buying a Home  You are here: About > Home & Garden > Home Buying / Selling Home & Garden Home Buying / Selling Essentials 10 Things Home Buyers Shouldn't Do Best Tips for First Time Home Buyers "Must-Do" Tasks Before You Sell How to Buy a Home, Step by Step For Sale by Owner Advice Articles & Resources How To Buy a Home How To Sell a House Celebrity & Historic Credit Reports & Scores Design & Remodel Home Maintenance Inspections & Appraisals Investing & Foreclosures Modular & Manufactured Mold, Radon, Lead, etc. Mortgage Advice Moving & Relocation Real Estate Careers Real Estate For Sale Vacation Homes Buyer's Guide Before You Buy Top Picks Home Buying Books Foreclosure Books Mortgage Books Product Reviews Forums Help FREE Newsletter Sign Up Now for the Home Buying / Selling newsletter! See Online Courses   Search Home Buying / Selling From Janet Wickell , Your Guide to Home Buying / Selling . FREE Newsletter. Sign Up Now! Getting Ready to Sell Your House Guests and lots of activities make it difficult to show a house during the holidays, so home owners sometimes put off selling their homes until after the first week in January, when life starts returning to normal. If you're in that category take some time to evaluate the condition of your home before you list it with an agent or sell it by owner . Be sure to analyze your situation to determine if selling is your best move, then think about the home's curb appeal and get the interior and exterior in tip-top shape . It's not a bad idea to do a few inspections to make sure the house is ready for potential buyers. Handle as many tasks as you can now and you'll find that the sales process will be a breeze. Monday December 26, 2005 | permalink Before You Buy Gas Logs Gas logs are growing in popularity every year, so manufacturers have geared-up to offer us a wide selection of appliances. You'll find gas logs to put in a hearth, freestanding gas stoves, and fully contained fireplace units that are mounted to a wall. But did you know that the dangerous gas byproducts produced by gas logs is not always vented to the outside? It's important to understand the differences between vented and vent-free logs before you buy a gas log fireplace. Saturday December 24, 2005 | permalink Pros and Cons of Becoming a Real Estate Agent You've decided you want to become a real estate agent, but what's your motivation? Do you understand the type of work real estate agents do and are you savvy about the true pay they receive for their work? It can be a rewarding career choice, but it's definitely not the best option for everyone and there are lots of things to consider before you decide that a real estate career is right for you. Wednesday December 21, 2005 | permalink Step-by-Step Directions Help You Measure Square Footage Each year, home owners discover that their new home's square footage is not the figure that was stated when the house was advertised. Owners sometimes decide to sue the people who were involved in the transaction, especially if the difference is significant. Real estate agents and for sale by owner sellers can reduce their risks of encountering a lawsuit by knowing how use accepted standards to measure and calculate a home's square footage . Get it right the first time so that everyone's happy with the results. Wednesday December 21, 2005 | permalink Buying Land for Your New Home If you've looked and looked, but can't find the perfect combination of land and house, maybe it's time to consider building. And while buying land for your new home can seem intimidating at first, you'll find it really isn't a horrible task if you fine-tune your wants and needs before you start searching for real estate. Tuesday December 20, 2005 | permalink Buying a Home with Great Resale Potential A few generations ago it wasn't unusual for people to live in the same home for many years, somtimes the rest of their lives after becoming homeowners. We're more mobile today, always "moving up" to a larger house or relocating to a new town. So it makes sense to put some thought into buying a home with good resale value , one that will sell easily and put extra dollars in your bank account if you do decide to move. Tuesday December 20, 2005 | permalink What's a Quit Claim Deed? Home buyers usually receive a general warranty deed when they purchase real estate, because it's a type of deed that offers several guarantees from the seller that the title to the property is good. Another document that's sometimes used is a quit claim deed . It works perfectly for some situations, but it's important to understand the limitations of a quit claim deed before accepting one when you purchase real estate. Friday December 16, 2005 | permalink How Credit Scores Are Calculated Everyone looking for a mortgage to buy a home--and that's most of us--finds out right away that credit scores play a huge role in the types of loans and interest rates that are offered to them. It's helpful to study your credit reports and scores before you apply for a mortgage, and to do it as early as possible to give yourself time to correct errors before a lender takes a look. Wednesday December 14, 2005 | permalink Moving Tips and Timeline Buying a home is exciting, but let's face it... moving is a chore. A big one. The only way I know to get through it without an excess of stress is to manage the moving process in little steps instead of letting it overwhelm you at the last minute. Start early and stay organized and you'll be ready for the moving truck before you know it. Monday December 12, 2005 | permalink Typical Home Buyer Closing Costs Closing costs are the expenses associated with buying real estate. You can expect to pay a large chunk of your closing costs the day the trasaction is complete, when the property becomes yours, but some closing expenses are nearly always paid before that day. There's no single set of expenses that every home buyer must pay--every transaction is different--but it's a good idea to become familiar with typical closing costs so that you'll have a better understanding of the items billed to you on your HUD-1 settlement statement . Wednesday December 07, 2005 | permalink Display Latest Headlines | | | Read Archives powered by Movable Type Important disclaimer information about this About site. Advertisement Related Blogs Mortgage Fraud Blog The Real Estate Blog The Money Pit Most Popular Modular and Manufactured Homes Finding Your Best Place to ... Home Buying Don'ts First Time Home Buyer Tips Before You Sell Your Home What's Hot Coping with Unethical People How To Buy Land Real Estate Appraisal Before You Buy a Log Home Package Home Buying / Selling - GuideReviews Related Topics Home Repair Architecture Credit / Debt Management Housekeeping Landscaping        Topic Index | Email to a Friend Our Story | Be a Guide | Advertising Info | Work at About | Site Map | Icons | Help User Agreement | Ethics Policy | Patent Info. | Privacy Policy | Kids' Privacy Policy ©2005 About, Inc., A part of the New York Times Company . All rights reserved. Around About Oprah's Life Vacation Ideas Shop Safely Online VIDEO: Craft Rooms VIDEO: Christmas Traditions What's Hot Coping with Unethical People How To Buy Land Real Estate Appraisal Before You Buy a Log Home Package Home Buying / Selling - GuideReviews Headlines Getting Ready to Sell Your House Guests and lots of activities make it difficult to show... Before You Buy Gas Logs Gas logs are growing in popularity every year, so manufacturers... Pros and Cons of Becoming a Real Estate Agent You've decided you want to become a real estate agent,... Step-by-Step Directions Help You Measure Square Footage Each year, home owners discover that their new home's square...

Home Equity Home Equity

Home Equity Calculators - Quicken Loans America's Home Loan Experts SM GO My Quicken Loans Login Great Rates. Expert Advice. Fast Process. Call 800-251-9080 To Get Your Rate   Refinance Refinance Center Learn About Refinancing Refinance Calculators Refinance Loan Options Contact a Refinance Expert Home Purchase Home Purchase Center Learn About Buying a Home Home Purchase Calculators Home Purchase Loan Options Contact a Purchase Expert Home Equity Home Equity Center Learn About Home Equity Home Equity Calculators Home Equity Loan Options Calculators Calculators Refinance Calculators Home Purchase Calculators Home Equity Calculators Contact a Loan Expert Loan Options Loan Options Refinance Loan Options Purchase Loan Options Home Equity Loan Options Contact a Loan Expert Bad Credit Rates   Refinance Calculators Home Purchase Calculators Home Equity Loan Calculators Contact a Loan Expert   Mortgage Calculators Home Equity Calculators Home Value How Much Can You Borrow Consolidate Debt Tax Savings Choose a Home Equity Calculator Below: Consolidate Debt Calculate the advantages of using a home equity loan to consolidate debt. How Much Can You Borrow? Answer two questions to calculate the most you can borrow against the equity in your home. Home Value Calculator Use this calculator to get an instant estimate of your home's current market value. Simply enter the property's location, purchase date, price and the cost of any structural improvements. Tax Savings Calculator* Find out the tax advantages of a home equity loan. *Please consult your tax advisor for more information. Refinancing | Home Loans | Home Equity Loans | My Quicken Loans Login Mortgage News | Mortgage Rates | Mortgage Calculators | Apply Online About Us | Careers | Contact Us | Feedback | Site Map | Help | Search Security and Privacy | Disclosures and Licenses | Terms of Use © 2000 - 2005 Quicken Loans Inc., All rights reserved. Lending services provided by Quicken Loans Inc., a subsidiary of Rock Holdings Inc. “Quicken Loans” is a registered service mark of Intuit Inc., used under license. Build 2741 2005-10-25 09:50:43

Home Loan How to

Wisconsin Department of Veterans Affairs Primary Mortgage Loan Page | Home | About WDVA | Current Events | Forms & Brochures | News & Publications | Federal Veterans Benefits | State Veterans Benefits | Eligibility | Education Programs | Emergency Grants | Employment Assistance | Help for the Homeless | I Owe You Program | Job Retraining Grants | Loans | Military Funeral Honors | Transportation to VA Medical Appointments | Veterans Cemeteries | Veterans Homes | Veterans Memorials | Veterans Museum | Veterans Service Offices | Women Veterans | Veterans Links | Site Map | Contact WDVA | Wisconsin Department of Veterans Affairs "Making a difference in the lives of Wisconsin Veterans" > Home > State Veterans Benefits > Loans > Primary Mortgage Loan Home Loan How to Apply | Requirements | Eligibility Current Interest Rate 5.99% Don't miss out on the ADVANTAGES of a WDVA Primary Mortgage Loan! Finance up to 95% of the purchase price of an existing home or cost to construct a new home. Refinance the balance due on mortgage loans. 30-year Fixed Rate -Lower monthly principal and interest payments that will never increase. Low down payment (5% down). Low closing costs, no points . No prepayment penalty. WDVA pays the loan origination fees of veterans with 30% or more service conected disabilities. No private mortgage insurance (PMI). Lenders require PMI for loans with less than a 20% down payment. Wisconsin offers a state veterans home loan program, entitled the Primary Mortgage Loan (PML), that is different from the USDVA Home Loan Guaranty Program. The state veterans home loan may be used for: Purchase or purchase and improvement of a single family home or condominium. Construction of a new single family home. Purchase of certain existing 2 to 4-unit owner occupied residence. (Must be occupied as borrower's principal residence.) Refinance of the balance due on existing mortgage loans used for purchase, construction, or improvement of a residence. COMPARE MONTHLY PAYMENTS for a $250,000, 30 year, 5% down Conventional WDVA Savings Rate 5.85% 5.99% P&I $1,475 $1,497 PMI $163 $0 Payment $1,638 $1,497 $141 SAVE $1,692 ANNUALLY Requirements The state veterans home loan is available to: Eligible Wisconsin veterans. Members and former members of the National Guard and Reserve who have completed 6 years of continuous service under honorable conditions. Unremarried spouses and dependent children of eligible deceased veterans. Eligibility Before you can apply for a loan you must establish eligibility for Wisconsin veterans benefits and then obtain a Certificate of Eligibility. Contact your County Veterans Service Office for assistance. If you have had past benefits with WDVA, you can obtain your Certificate of Eligibility on our Web site. How To Apply Bring your WDVA Certificate of Eligibility to a participating lender when you apply for your state veterans home loan. Local banks, savings and loans, credit unions, and mortgage brokers participate in our home loan program. For More Information For loan-specific questions, call 1-800-WIS-VETS (947-8387), or email the Loan Section . For eligibility and application process questions, contact your County Veterans Service Office . The information above regarding WDVA loans is not all-inclusive and may change without notice. WARNING: The WDVA receives a statewide support lien docket listing all individuals who have a delinquent child-support obligation in Wisconsin. According to state law, the WDVA may not approve a Primary Mortgage Loan or a Home Improvement Loan for any applicant on the docket unless the applicant provides one of the following items: Provides a statement signed by the Wisconsin Department of Workforce Development or its designee showing that all delinquent obligations have been paid. A copy of a child-support repayment agreement that has been kept current for the six month period before the date the WDVA receives the application as long as no lien exists. Wisconsin Department of Veterans Affairs 30 W. Mifflin Street • Madison, WI 53703 (608) 266-1311 or toll-free 1-800-WIS-VETS (947-8387) Legal Notices and Disclaimers Email: Webmaster

real estate prices in

MemeFirst: New York real-estate prices explained -- MemeFirst December 01, 2005 New York real-estate prices explained The 2.2 million jobs in Manhattan pay, on average, $2,025 per week . (You know that feeling you get when you find out you're below average? I've been having that for years.) Manhattan is 22 square miles, which means that the island of Manhattan pays, on average, $378 per square foot per year . And that includes Washington Heights. Posted by Felix at 02:54 PM GMT All proceeds go to MSF -- Comments #1 Pity we can't all work for Goldman Sachs. Posted by: Gherimiah on December 1, 2005 03:28 PM #2 I'll happily defer to someone with a firmer grasp of stats on this, but in the meantime, I wonder, does that average income number tell you very much? Given the massive disparity in Manhattan incomes, between, say, the dishwasher and the hedge-fund owner, which surely are among the widest in the country, wouldn't you also need to know the distribution of the data points? At a minium, wouldn't you want also to know the median income? Also, is this net or gross? Article talked about paychecks, which could probably mean either. Posted by: Matthew on December 1, 2005 04:36 PM #3 Oh, and also, Felix, presumably the 2.2 million people with jobs in Manhattan don't all live there, so your extrapolation doesn't wash. Posted by: Matthew on December 1, 2005 04:38 PM #4 Obvs mean incomemedian income, and I'd be surprised if more than 40% of Manhattanites made above average. Probably less. But even so. And actually, the fact that there are 2.2 million jobs to 1.5 million people in Manhattan actually only serves to exacerbate the demand-supply imbalance when it comes to real estate. Posted by: Felix on December 1, 2005 04:53 PM #5 I hate to be the one to break this to you, Felix, but nearly all residential housing in Manhattan consists of multi-story buildings. The salary range you describe explains real estate prices in Westchester County, NY and Bergen County, NJ to about the same degree as prices in Manhattan. Posted by: Sterling on December 1, 2005 07:05 PM #6 How delightful that the discussion of property prices one is sometimes unable to defuse at dinner parties just carries on here - almost as if taunting one with its dreary ineluctability. And how nice that Felix should bring along his no doubt expert appreciation of statistical lore. The one thing I am missing is the crucial evaluation of bedbug incidence as it affects property prices in Manhattan. In another thread, Betty has said this bedbug malarkey is all a plan of Bush's. For myself, I prefer to recall that bedbugs tend to originate in Belgium. Schtumm for now. More on this later. Posted by: Claude de Bigny on December 1, 2005 08:40 PM #7 Also, this seems to imply that everyone pays all of their income for housing, which is hopefully not the case. To be more realistic (ignoring the issues rightly brought up by the other commentators, including whether all of those people actually live in Manhattan and whether you can just take the sq ftge of Manhattan as the residential sq ftge), say people on average spend 40% of their income on housing. That gets your income for housing per sq ft to around $151. Posted by: Susan on December 1, 2005 09:14 PM #8 Susan and Sterling, you are embarassingly confused. What percentage of real estate in Manhattan is used for housing? According to this http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/pdf/landusefacts/landuse_tables.pdf (in case you are confused by the graph, the percents sum together veritcally and the land area sum horizontally). And even assuming that all "Mixed Residential and Commercial" was used for housing, less than 38% of the land in Manhattan is for housing. These data certainly allow for the idea that much of rent paid in Manhattan is for commercial use, and even then, a considerable percent is used for public space (Central Park alone is 10% of the area of Manhattan). Anyway, the amount people earn in a particular location is not directly related to the amount the people who live there earn, or the amount the people live there pay for rent. Look at this site: http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/saipe/index.html The direct link is unavailable, but the Median household income for New York County was 43,573. Nassau County on the other hand is more than 71,000. In which place is it cheaper to rent by the foot? Posted by: Andrew on December 2, 2005 07:22 AM #9 I don't think I'm confused. My points are: a) there is actually quite a bit more than 22 square miles of residential floor space in Manhattan because of vertical construction b) a lot of upper-income Manhattan workers live outside Manhattan, and their buying power lifts prices in tony bedroom communities Posted by: Sterling on December 3, 2005 03:38 PM #10 OK, Sterling, let's do it your way. Assume that each of the 1.5 million residents of Manhattan has 400 square feet to call their own: that works out to 1200 square feet for the average family of three and 1600 square feet for the average family of four. Generous, I'd say. That comes out to 600 million square feet of residential real estate in Manhattan. Using that figure, my calculation actually comes out slightly higher : $386 per square foot per year, rather than $378. What makes you think that there's more than 22 square miles of residential floor space in Manhattan? As for your point b, I fail to see how it is in any way germane. Posted by: Felix on December 3, 2005 11:09 PM #11 OK, 22 square miles equals about 613,324,800 square feet. That would leave each of Manhattan's 1.5 million residents with 409 square feet of living space. But I don't believe that most Manhattan residents are actually so deprived, especially when you take into account common areas in apartment buildings such as laundry facilities, hallways, lobbies, etc. I'd be surprised if the average wasn't at least 600, and it's probably more than 800. And besides, that's not what you originally meant - you were dividing Manhattan's land footprint and not taking into account its vertical expansion. As for the second point, I suspect there's a strong tendency among $100,000 - $1,000,000 per annum Manhattan earners - which is well-off to wealthy-on-a-budget - to live in places like Valhalla and Ho-Ho-Kus, especially if they're married with kids. Family-flight in turn increases the average per-capita-square-footage of the Manhattan residential footprint through bleed-off of children. Posted by: Sterling on December 4, 2005 02:29 AM #12 Sterling jumped the shark so long ago it's probably not surprising, but for those of you keeping score at home, he really did just say that the average Manhattanite has 800 square feet of their own. So if you're an average person living with 2 roommates, that means you're in a 2400 square foot apartment. In Manhattan. Yeah. Oh, and that 350 square foot apartment you've got? It's not 350 square feet at all, it's probably more than 4000 square feet. You're just not including the lobby and all the hallways. Posted by: Felix on December 4, 2005 02:43 AM #13 My claim is that the amount of residential-zoned floor space in Manhattan probably works out to between 600 and 800 square feet per resident of Manhattan. You're not only challenging this, but asserting that my claim is absurd. Sure you wanna do that? Posted by: Sterling on December 4, 2005 02:59 AM #14 I've tried to find the statistic, but to no avail. It seems that while office space inventor is measured in square footage, residential space is simply measured, in all documents, by units. But we can work with that. So far I've learned that 82% of zoned lots in Manhattan are residential, making up about 280,000,000 square feet, which includes permanently undeveloped spaces like yards and gardens. If the average height of development across all that land is four stories, then, we're looking at about 750 square feet per person. I've also learned that in 1999 there were about 727,000 residential units in Manhattan , which means that the average unit houses two people. So those three-roomies crammed into one 800-square-foot-tenement-with-the-bathtub-in-the-kitchen examples are mostly fiction. Which is a shame because I get a tingle from the mental picture of Manhattan twenty- and thirty-somethings living in cramped, dingy conditions. If we divide the total residential land area by the total number of units, we get 385 square feet, which works out to 192.5 square feet per person, assuming no dwellings above one story in height and no unimproved/vacant land. If the average height is assumed to be four stories, in this scenario we get about 770 square feet per person. Here's a report from Prudential Douglas Elliman that details its 1Q 2005 sales. Units sold averaged 1,334 square feet, which divided by two yields 767 square feet per person. Breaking it down further we find co-ops averaging 1,197 square feet, condos at 1,496 square feet, luxury at 2,921 and loft at 2,145. So that's 598.5 square feet per person at the low end all the way up to 1,460.5 at the top. There's three separate analytical models for you Felix, all of which yield per-person square footage of 750 or better. I admit they're not all that fleshed out, but I'm stuck inside with a cold watching The Taking of Pelham One-Two-Three on DVD, and I'm disinclined to dig deeper. But you're welcome to. Posted by: Sterling on December 4, 2005 04:04 AM #15 Sterling: do your calculations include infrastructure or is the 280MM number a percentage of raw space? Building density is higher here than anywhere else in America, but 15% to circulation (in buildings and streets themeselves) would be an easily defended metric. Counting hallways in urban residential structures is like counting sidewalks as part of sf for suburban homes. As much Sterling does sound like a set designer for Friends, Felix, I gotta say, of the 25 or so apartments of people that I can definitely make an estimate of size, we average 500 sf easy. Most everyone is a half a standard tenement lot (25 x 25), with a couple of lofts and post-war, large-scale developments thrown in. This is skewed because many of them are single (I live in a 2bd alone) or have rent-controlled apartments from way back. Posted by: 99 on December 4, 2005 07:19 PM #16 Where does your 280m sq ft number come from? Your first two calculations are based on it, so I'd like to know. (They're also based on a multiplier of 4, which as far as I can tell came pretty much out of thin air.) As for apartment sales, in Manhattan individual condos and coops tend to be much larger than the apartments inside rental buildings. So if you look just at sold apartments as opposed to rented apartments, you're going to get a skewed figure. What's more, if a 3800-square-foot brownstone in Harlem, say, is sold and then the downstairs floor is rented out, that still counts as a 3800 square foot deal under these figures. Posted by: Felix on December 4, 2005 09:21 PM #17 The multiplier of 4 was back-of-envelope guess. The 280,000,000 number came from this PDF . Sorry, thought I'd linked to it initially. As for rental apartments being smaller than privately owned condos or co-ops...not sure I buy that. But even if it's true, how much smaller could they be? 10%? Doesn't really matter. You can apologize any time now. Posted by: Sterling on December 4, 2005 10:06 PM #18 if anyone is real curious why not pony up the $250 to get a list of every tax lot in the city? http://www.nyc.gov/html/dcp/html/bytes/applbyte.shtml in the meantime, simply because i am tired of having to read sterlings pontifications about things he knows anything about, i downloaded a list of all the residential tax lots from 14th street and below from propertyshark. only 14th street and below, because after 6000+ entries, i became bored. 14th street down is a good representative sample of the 99000+ residential tax lots in manhattan. it includes spacious luxury lofts of tribeca, tenements of the les, projects on the eastside, high rise high density battery park and half building condo conversions of downtown (note that a rental bldg with multiple units counts as a single tax lot with the number of units listed as a seperate data field). the average unit size works out to 1100sf with 590sf per person (based 2000 census population stats for 14th st & below). this includes all common space in a building as it is based on total building size for single tax lot (rental) buildings and counts common space tax lots for condo buildings (read lobbies, circ, etc.) multiplying back out by the 2000 census population numbers for manhattan of 1,537,195... we get 906,945,050sf of residential space in manhattan. let's call that an even 9Bsf since the city lists 3800 acres of lot area in manhattan (165,500,000sf), that gives a rough overbuild factor of 5.5. this will obviously skew higher with the ues & uws densities without actually affecting the sf/person. summary- -590sf of residential per person (inclusive of common areas). close to sterlings low estimate of 600, but nowhere near the 800sf -1100sf average size per unit (inclusive of common areas). again close to sterlings guess based on broker mumbojumbo, but still below the stated average. -9Bsf of residential space in manhattan sterling- close on your numbers, but not nearly close enough to be quite so pompously smug. stick to things you know about, like why bush is a foreign policy genius. felix- remind me what this related to? Posted by: geoff on December 5, 2005 12:34 AM #19 Geoff - The only reason I was pompously snug is because Felix had reacted to to my estimates with such comedic outrage. Also, I don't think 14th St. and below is a good representative sample. Newer and I suspect more spacious high-rises make up a much larger proportion of housing from the 30s up through the low 100s. So I'm sticking with 600+. I suspect the actual number is around 750, as stated above. As for your justification of your work - "simply because i am tired of having to read sterlings pontifications about things he knows anything about" - I'm not sure what it means. Perhaps you meant to write "nothing" instead of "anything"? I'm not claiming to be right all the time - I am not right all the time. I am, however, pretty much always right whenever Felix gets all worked up and tells me I have no idea what I'm talking about. Thanks for your small role in marking off another example for me to throw back at him at some future date. Posted by: Sterling on December 5, 2005 06:19 AM #20 Renter-occupied apartments are much smaller than owner-occupied apartments. And as the PDF you yourself linked to shows (see page 24), the vast majority of apartments in Manhattan are renter-occupied. Think about it: one needs maybe 350 sq ft per person to live in some reasonable comfort. Beyond that, you're shelling out extra cash for extra space. Owners are happy doing that because they have 100% equity in that space: everyone has heard the advice that they should buy the biggest apartment they can afford. Renters, on the other hand, are simply giving away thousands of dollars in rent every month, with nothing at all to show for it. So they tend to go not for the biggest apartment they can afford, but rather the cheapest apartment they find adequate. Put it this way: Manhattan is full of individuals spending an enormous proportion of their income on outsize mortgage payments. Almost everyone, when they move from renting to buying, sees their monthly housing costs rise substantially. If you move to Manhattan and have a relatively low income, then you might spend a crazy amount of it on rent, it's true. But if your income is average or higher (and remember that average is $2,025 per week), I very much doubt that your rent is making nearly as much of a dent in your paycheck as it would if you owned your own apartment. You reach a standard of living you're comfortable with, and you stop. Anything beyond that is money which you could otherwise spend on clothes, or travel, or restaurants. Whereas if you buy , you're not spending so much as investing. The only money which you're really spending is the interest on your mortgage -- and even that comes with a tax deduction. Or let's put it another way. That Elliman report you linked to has an average sales price of $1.21 million. A typical rental yield in Manhattan these days is 4%, so if rentals were functionally identical to owner-occupied apartments, which you seem to assume, then the average rent in Manhattan would be over $4,000 a month. In fact, of course, it's nowhere near that. Posted by: Felix on December 5, 2005 06:55 AM #21 There's the shark, and then there's the A train. Sterling's Manhattan clearly stops at 96th street. Sterling, dear, north of that bright white line, the housing stock is incredibly stable and consistent in terms of size and layout. Harlem is just now getting it's first 'luxury' apartment building in a half century. Any larger apartment complexes are housing projects, which have smaller units by definition, and, allowing for the dispersal of the towers in some International Style fantasy also insures that the density does not increase much. Posted by: 99 on December 5, 2005 04:03 PM #22 Felix, just because apartments are currently going for $1.21 million a pop doesn't mean that everyone who owns an apartment paid that much. Rent prices move in sympathy with real estate prices but are less prone to bubbles. What you're missing here, and you've missed the same thing when we've talked about the stock market in the past, is the difference between speculative investors and income investors. Speculators don't buy an apartment (or apartment building) primarily for the benefit of the rent; their main motivation is the hope of flipping the property at some later date for a larger sum than they paid for it. The current Manhattan real estate bubble is the product of speculators. Real estate income investors view rent collection as their goal - most apartment buildings in any town or city in the U.S. are owned by income investors. They get less press than speculators, but they also tend to go bankrupt less often. The market value of a rental property can be determined by the amount of rent it generates for the owner, not the other way around. Manhattan rents are high - probably even ludicrously high - but that is a function of large demand chasing relatively low supply, and is only weakly related to current real estate prices. I do acknowledge your point about space not being a priority for Manhattan renters, there is some truth in that. People who do see space as a necessity tend to wind up in rental units in Brooklyn, Queens or Hudson County. But that's not exclusively the case. Posted by: Sterling on December 5, 2005 04:59 PM #23 This thread is hilarious and sad, although a good example of how the same statistics can be applied to support any and all political positions. Posted by: sac on December 5, 2005 06:39 PM #24 Sterling, Manhattan is the one real-estate market in the US where there are, to all intents and purposes, zero speculators under your definition. No one buys Manhattan property in order to flip it. For one thing, co-op boards (and even condo boards, for that matter) hate flippers, and are likely to punish them. There's flip taxes, brokers' fees of 6% for the seller, and a luxury tax of 1% on any apartment over $1m for the buyer. Prices are so high that the carrying costs are enormous -- and you can't rent out the apartment in the meantime, because that makes it pretty much unsaleable. There are, of course, lots of buildings owned by income investors in New York. Most of the East Village, where I live, is comprised of such buildings: they normally have 20 or so apartments (say 5 floors, 4 apartments per floor), and they've been going up in price almost as much as individual apartments have -- the only reason they haven't gone up just as much is because many of the tenants are rent-controlled or rent-stabilised below market. These are typical New York apartments, from a renter's point of view -- but I can tell you, as someone who was apartment hunting in the East Village for almost a year, they're much less typical from an owner's point of view. Also, there's a strong incentive for for-sale apartments to be as large as possible: price per square foot is positively correlated with size. That's not the case in the rental market: it's easier to rent out a 650sqft apartment for $2500 than it is to rent out a 1300sqft apartment for $5000. Posted by: Felix on December 5, 2005 09:14 PM #25 "Manhattan is the one real-estate market in the US where there are, to all intents and purposes, zero speculators under your definition. No one buys Manhattan property in order to flip it." Felix, of course people speculate on property in Manhattan. Just because the barriers to entry are high doesn't mean some won't jump them. How else do you think a modest apartment winds up costing as much as a dozen Mercedes-Benz CL500s? Who do you imagine is providing demand at that level? You know banks are not issuing $1,000,000 mortgages to households with joint incomes of $200,000. It's trust fund kiddies - who are often divorced from fiscal reality - and speculators. As for your point about different-sized apartments being suitable for rent versus sale, I might agree with you except for the fact that every rental apartment IS OWNED by someone. It IS PART of the for sale market. I'd be surprised if fewer than half of the condos in Manhattan are rented out by their owners. Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 01:51 AM #26 Sterling, I'm afraid the factors leading to high apartment prices are much more mundane than your feverish mind would like to imagine. Lots of global liquidity, driving down interest rates and banks' credit tests. Lots of demand, due to Manhattan's status as the center of the universe and high Wall Street bonuses. And very limited supply. The market for flippers is Miami, not NYC -- where a condo can be bought and sold three or four times before it is even built. As for your point about rental apartments being owned by someone, it sounds clever until you stop to think about what I've already said. Rental buildings are owned by landlords; the vast majority of condos and co-ops are owner-occupied. For one thing, co-ops vastly outnumber condos, and they're hard to rent. And as for condos, they generally get rented out when they're not the place their owner really wants to live. Given how valuable they are, few owners who don't want to live here would rather rent out their condos rather than simply sell them. Take my East Village condo building, for instance: when it went condo in 1983, only one owner lived here. Today, all the units bar one are owner-occupied. I haven't done my homework on this, but I'll happily accept your wager: I'll bet the standard bottle of vintage champagne that more than half the condos in Manhattan are owner-occupied. Deal? Posted by: Felix on December 6, 2005 02:43 AM #27 If you go double or nothing on the proposition that the amount of existing residential floor space in Manhattan divided by the number of residents of Manhattan is equal to or greater than 600 sq. ft., then it's a bet. How are we going to research this? FWIW, I am descended from a man who is reputed to be the first person to negotiate a real estate deal in New York: Wessel Wesselse (ten Broek). He may have been the man to offer 60 guilders (often misreported as $24) as the purchase price of Manhattan from the Canarsies. (Technically the Canarsies didn't own Manhattan Island - it's not for nothing that "Canarsie" is in Brooklyn. Also technically the Dutch West India Company didn't care which tribe owned it. It just needed some bunch of natives to smile and sign off on the deal to keep the English away.) This of course conveys no special knowledge upon me, but it certainly adds a humorous subtext to our disagreement. Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 04:14 AM #28 I'm not sure about the terms of the wager: we seem to be betting on two different things at the same time. But spell it out, and I'll be amenable. I do want to ensure, of course, that hallways and elevator shafts and the like do not count as residential floor space. And please also ensure that if one of the propositions can be determined while the other one can't, then the other wager still stands. Posted by: Felix on December 6, 2005 05:55 AM #29 I'm not sure how we could specify the terms to exclude elevators if they are included in filings. However, it occurs to me that Manhattan Borough probably requires a statement of total dwelling space for its Certificate of Occupancy, so that would work for me. And no, I think double or nothing sounds good to me, especially since we will be attempting to falsify two of my estimations, rather than either of yours. Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 06:20 AM #30 You've lost me, I'm afraid. When you say "double or nothing", are you proposing a 2BVC bet on the residential floor space, and no bet at all on the proportion of condos which are rented out? Or what? It makes no sense to me: "double or nothing" normally happens after A has lost a bet and B has won it. Then going double or nothing means that either B wins double the original amount, or he wins nothing. You essentially run the bet over again. Are you maybe trying to propose something whereby if I lose I lose 2BVCs, and if I win I win nothing? Posted by: Felix on December 6, 2005 07:44 AM #31 Are you trying to squirm out of it? Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 06:03 PM #32 Sterling, will you propose your bet already? I've already said that I'm likely to accept. Just tell me the terms! Posted by: Felix on December 6, 2005 06:12 PM #33 I did! Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 06:25 PM #34 OK, have a few moments now, I had to get someplace before 2pm and the roads are crap with snow and slush. Um, OK. My terms for the bet is those two things specified, avg. sq. footage = 600 and = 50% of condos. Either side has to get both right to collect. gotta run Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 06:51 PM #35 So if one of us gets both right, he wins 1BVC or 2BVCs? And if one of the two turns out to be unverifiable, then it's a wash? Posted by: Felix on December 6, 2005 07:22 PM #36 Honestly, Felix, I doubt either number is verifiable. Like I wrote above, the city appears to track residential rental inventory by units, rather than by square footage. Also, most owners of condominium units who rent them out do so through agents - even the tenant may be only vaguely aware of the legal status of the unit. In NJ I don't think an individual condo owner even needs to report the unit as a rental property if it's in a building that's already inspected under multi-family housing regulations (or if it's a standalone unit or duplex). The rent revenue has to be reported as taxable income, naturallly, but not to any entity with housing oversight. So make it for one bottle and yes both figures have to be verifiable. That said, if either of us can show a grouping of not-completely-conclusive figures from multiple sources that seem reasonable and fall long or short of my guesses by ten percent or more, then I think we should accept them. (Of course, I have arguably already met this condition with my square footage prediction, and Geoff's calculations don't contradict it under the 10% rule I suggest.) Posted by: Sterling on December 6, 2005 10:05 PM #37 as i mentioned earlier, you can get the sf and unit count for every residential tax lot in the city from the cities web site... google 'bytes of the big apple' and look at the 'pluto' product. the license fee is $250 or you can get the info from propertyshark.com. there are 99000+ listings for manhattan. at 100 listings per page, thats a lot of cutting and pasting into excel. both of these will give you tax lot sizes (whole buildings/unit count or condo unit), which will be inclusive of common area. 10-15% is considered a fairly standard deduction for circulation. mechanical space is not included in the floor area count. happy dueling Posted by: geoff on December 6, 2005 10:29 PM Post a comment Name: Email Address: URL: Remember personal info? Yes No Anti-spam question: Share four cupcakes equally among four people. How many does each person get (in digits)? 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(7) Comments 06/12: geoff: as i mentioned earlier, you can get the sf and unit count for every residential tax lot in the ci 06/12: Sterling: Honestly, Felix, I doubt either number is verifiable. Like I wrote above, the city appears to tr 06/12: Felix: So if one of us gets both right, he wins 1BVC or 2BVCs? And if one of the two turns out to be unv 06/12: Sterling: OK, have a few moments now, I had to get someplace before 2pm and the roads are crap with snow an 06/12: Sterling: I did! 06/12: Felix: Sterling, will you propose your bet already? I've already said that I'm likely to accept. Just te 06/12: Sterling: Are you trying to squirm out of it? 06/12: Felix: You've lost me, I'm afraid. When you say "double or nothing", are you proposing a 2BVC bet on the 06/12: Sterling: I'm not sure how we could specify the terms to exclude elevators if they are included in filings. 06/12: Felix: I'm not sure about the terms of the wager: we seem to be betting on two different things at the s 06/12: Sterling: If you go double or nothing on the proposition that the amount of existing residential floor spac 06/12: Felix: Sterling, I'm afraid the factors leading to high apartment prices are much more mundane than your 06/12: Sterling: "Manhattan is the one real-estate market in the US where there are, to all intents and purposes, 05/12: Felix: Sterling, Manhattan is the one real-estate market in the US where there are, to all intents and p 05/12: sac: This thread is hilarious and sad, although a good example of how the same statistics can be appli 05/12: Sterling: Felix, just because apartments are currently going for $1.21 million a pop doesn't mean that ever 05/12: 99: There's the shark, and then there's the A train. Sterling's Manhattan clearly stops at 96th stree 05/12: Felix: Renter-occupied apartments are much smaller than owner-occupied apartments. And as the < 05/12: Sterling: Geoff - The only reason I was pompously snug is because Felix had reacted to to my estimates with 05/12: geoff: if anyone is real curious why not pony up the $250 to get a list of every tax lot in the city?<br 04/12: Sterling: The multiplier of 4 was back-of-envelope guess. The 280,000,000 number came from <a href 04/12: Felix: Where does your 280m sq ft number come from? Your first two calculations are based on it, so I'd 04/12: 99: Sterling: do your calculations include infrastructure or is the 280MM number a percentage of raw 04/12: Sterling: I've tried to find the statistic, but to no avail. It seems that while office space inventor is 04/12: Sterling: My claim is that the amount of residential-zoned floor space in Manhattan probably works out to b 04/12: Felix: Sterling jumped the shark so long ago it's probably not surprising, but for those of you keeping 04/12: Sterling: OK, 22 square miles equals about 613,324,800 square feet. That would leave each of Manhattan's 1 03/12: Felix: OK, Sterling, let's do it your way. Assume that each of the 1.5 million residents of Manhattan ha 03/12: Sterling: I don't think I'm confused. My points are: a) there is actually quite a bit more than 22 02/12: Andrew: Susan and Sterling, you are embarassingly confused. What percentage of real estate in Manhattan i Trackbacks